Ellen White: Teaches Jesus was a Sinner

jesus-cooks-fish

The teachings of Ellen White on health reform are all over the map.  It is hard to get a clear vein of thought on what it is that she wanted to convey at any particular time.  But since I established HERE that she taught all of her words written down on any letter or book  were inspired that means everything is on the table.  There is a very clear teaching in her writings that eating meat is a sin.  Below is a list of her statements to this effect.

“The simple grains, fruits of the trees, vegetables, have all the nutritive properties necessary to make good blood. This a flesh diet cannot do.” – Ellen White, Counsels on Diet and Foods, 322

“The eating of flesh meats has made a poor quality of blood and flesh… Flesh meats will depreciate the blood.” 2T 61, 368

“Flesh meat…is…corrupting to the lifeblood coursing through the veins.” MM 310

“The light has come to me for many years that meat eating is not good for health or morals.”- Ellen White, Counsels on Diet and Foods, Pg 413

“…meat eating deranges the system, beclouds the intellect, and blunts the moral sensibilities.” 2T 64

“You place on your table butter, eggs, and meat, and your children partake of them. They are fed with the very things that will excite their animal passions, and then you come to meeting and ask God to bless and save your children. How high do your prayers go?” —2T, p. 362.

“Those who digress occasionally to gratify the taste in eating a fattened turkey or other flesh meats, pervert their appetites, and are not the ones to judge the benefits of the system of health reform. They are controlled by taste, not by principle.” — – Ellen White, Counsels on Diet and Foods, Pg. 399.

“No man can become a successful workman in spiritual things until he observes strict temperance in his dietetic habits. God cannot let His Holy Spirit rest upon those who, while they know how they should eat for health, persist in a course that will enfeeble mind and body.” – Ellen White, Counsels on Diet and Foods, Pg 55

Notice she says “God cannot let His Holy Spirit rest upon those who…”.  Why is it that God cannot do that?  I thought he could do anything.  If she is saying that he won’t rather than is not capable then the problem is just as bad because she is teaching that you cannot be saved unless you submit to health reform.

God gave the light on health reform, and those that reject it reject God.” — Series B, No. 6, p. 31. EGW address to the General Conference in Oakland, published in the General Conference Bulletin, 1903, pp. 84-88.

“God has written His law upon every nerve and muscle, every fiber and function of the human body. The indulgence of unnatural appetite, whether for tea, coffee, tobacco, or liquor, is intemperance, and is at war with the laws of life and health. By using these forbidden articles a condition of things is created in the system which the Creator never designed. This indulgence in any of the members of the human family is sin. . . . the eating of food that does not make good blood is working against the laws of our physical organism, and is a violation of the law of God. The cause produces the effect. Suffering, disease, and death are the sure penalty of indulgence.” EV 265-266

The above quote is crucial in understanding her teachings on diet.  Notice she says that if you are “eating food that does not make good blood” you are in “violation of the law of God“.   What else can this be except sin?

Add this to the other quotes above teaching that:

  • meat blunts the morals,
  • those who do not submit are rejecting God,
  • your prayers don’t go high if you eat eggs,
  • controlled by taste not by principle
  • corrupting the lifeblood

Taken as a whole or in part it is clear that she teaches it is a sin to eat meat.  Modern SDA will argue that eating meat doesn’t become a sin until the health message was received and given to the world by Ellen White.

The problem is that they claim her message came from God.  God knows everything and would know what is sin and what is not sin.  All we need to do on this is to observe Christ.  Surely Christ would not have sinned and he would have known with or without Ellen White’s health message whether or not it is lawful to eat meat.

“Then came the day of Unleavened Bread, on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed.   So Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, “Go and prepare the Passover for us, that we may eat it.” Luke 22:7-8 ESV 

“See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.” ; And when he had said this, he showed them his hands and his feet. ; And while they still disbelieved for joy and were marveling, he said to them, “Have you anything here to eat?” ; They gave him a piece of broiled fish, ; and he took it and ate before them.” Luke 24:39-43 ESV

 

Above we see that Jesus ate lamb and a broiled fish.  Note that the latter is after the Resurrection, in his Glorified Body.  When put together with the teachings of Ellen White we can only assume that she either believed Jesus to be a sinner, or that he wasn’t aware of what sin is.

 

“There is a boy here who has five barley loaves and two fish, but what are they for so many?” Jesus said, “Have the people sit down.” Now there was much grass in the place. So the men sat down, about five thousand in number. Jesus then took the loaves, and when he had given thanks, he distributed them to those who were seated. So also the fish, as much as they wanted.  And when they had eaten their fill, he told his disciples, “Gather up the leftover fragments, that nothing may be lost.” John 6:9-12 ESV

Above we see Jesus fed the five thousand with many pounds of fish.  If this were a sin then Jesus would have been causing people to sin.  If we put this together with the teachings of Ellen White the only logical conclusion is that Jesus was a mass sinner who encouraged others to do the same, or he was simply ignorant of what is sin.

It doesn’t end there, we see also that Ellen White was guilty of eating meat.  She even did so after receiving the health message.

“Mary, if you can get me a good box of herrings, fresh ones, please do so. These last ones that Willie got are bitter and old. If you can buy cans, say, half a dozen cans, of good tomatoes, please do so. We shall need them. If you can get a few cans of good oysters, get them.” —Letter 16, 1882

“Christmas morning we all took breakfast together—James Cornell; Florence and Clara, their two girls; Brother and Sister Moore and their three children; Sister Bahler and Etta, a girl living with them; and Sister Daniells, our cook, Father, and myself. We had a quarter of venison cooked, and stuffing. It was as tender as a chicken. We all enjoyed it very much. There is plenty of venison in market. (Written December 26, 1878, from Denison, Texas, to “Dear Family at Battle Creek–Willie, Mary, Aunt Mary, Edith, Addie and May, and Brother and Sister Sawyer.”)” —Manuscript Releases, Volume Fourteen, p. 318. Letter 23, 1878.

I do not preach one thing and practice another. I do not present to my hearers rules of life for them to follow while I make an exception in my own case….” —Selected Messages Book 2, p. 302. Letter 12, 1888.

Clearly, Ellen White taught that both herself and Jesus Christ were sinners.  I don’t personally have a problem believing that Ellen White was a sinner and I don’t believe that SDA struggle with this either.  But to teach that Jesus was a sinner would mean that we would have no atonement, no sinless sacrifice as the propitiation of sins.

The truth is that we were warned this would happen a very long time ago by Paul.

“Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, ; through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared, ; who forbid marriage and require abstinence from foods that God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. ; For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, ; for it is made holy by the word of God and prayer.1 Tim 4:1-5 ESV

That passage fits Ellen White to a tee.  She was a messenger of a very deceitful spirit, be it her own imagination or that of a demon.  She taught abstinence from food that God had made clean and created to be received.  She is a false prophet and you need not fear her.  There are enough laws in the Bible we don’t need more, to do so is blasphemy as one has to put themselves in the place of God to make laws of God.

 

 

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About ACTheologian

I am a layman who blogs my Biblical studies. Enjoy, please read with an open Bible and do double check with your pastor.
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27 Responses to Ellen White: Teaches Jesus was a Sinner

  1. Darnley Thomas says:

    Am I missing something? The jump from meat to fish is unclear to me.

    Like

  2. Odoom charles says:

    The writer of this article has been blinded by the devil. ..I can authoritatively say that he or she is luciferan…may God heal you and give you wisdom for you to understand His words.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Armchair Theologian says:

      I can assure you I am not a luciferian. I am actually an LCMS Lutheran who grew up seventh day Adventist. The conclusions I reach are based on the Bible. If you discern I have mishandled a Biblical text or Ellen White quote let me know.

      Liked by 1 person

      • David Bhongs says:

        Lets put this in the simplest terms so that you can understand…A command is only broken when it is disobeyed, but FIRST it must be given. When none is given , none is broken. Jesus was never commanded by the Father not to eat these things. John the Baptist, on the other hand was commanded a certain diet which he fulfilled. Believe it or not , but E G White was given a command for the PRESENT and FUTURE generation to change diet. This command is not retroactive… no command is. So for you to say that Jesus is a sinner based on E G white is completely false. You are a false witness my friend.

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      • Armchair Theologian says:

        With respect i simply reject the premise of your argument. The Bible teaches one can sin without the law.

        “First let’s look at “Romans 2 where it speaks of those who ‘have sinned without the law,’ verse 12; and verse 14 speaks of ‘the Gentiles which have not the law.’ And Romans 5:13 says that ‘until the law sin was in the world.’ So sin does not depend upon the law.” – samuel fisk

        Even without a command law is law and sin is sin friend

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    • loribordessa says:

      I’m curious to know where, according to you, the writer was off scripturally. The only one off there was EGW. She, indeed, was the one whose writing doesn’t line up with God’s Word. BTW, you said ‘I can authoritatively say …” What authority was that?

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    • loribordessa says:

      Plus, your false ‘prophet’ was a hypocrite in her use of things like oysters. If eating meat was eqquivocal to sinning, eating UNCLEAN meat was even worse in SDAism. She preached against it but ate it anyway. It wasn’t a sin and she should have not treated it as such.

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  3. Nikki says:

    In the Adventist world, any animal flesh is referred to as meat. I have found that isn’t the case outside of Adventism. Usually people think of red meat when they hear the word meat. I remember when I was an SDA and I would tell people I was vegetarian it would irritate me when they would ask if I ate chicken or fish. I would usually say, “if it had a heart beat, I don’t eat it.”

    Liked by 1 person

    • Armchair Theologian says:

      I used Biblical quotes of fish because they are so plain. But nobody seriously contests that Jesus ate meat. He was Jewish and at the very least he would have been a part of the various temple feasts etc.

      Liked by 1 person

    • loribordessa says:

      Me to Nikki. It always puzzled me when I said I was vegetarian and then they asked me if I ate chicken or fish. HUH??!! Lol!! But no longer SDA and no longer vegetarian. My body craves protein. Meat works very well for me.

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  4. Sean McLeighlas says:

    Some things I consider, your quoting a passage form 1878 where she ate meat, then quoted her from 10 years later where she declares that meat shouldn’t be eaten, is it possible that she hadn’t yet received the vision or inspiration yet in 1878?..Something else to consider, everything has to be taken in context to its time, such as people who point out EGW said people shouldn’t buy bicycles, it was relevant to the times she lived, and more of an example of people spending money on a frivolous item they really couldn’t afford…. So how does meat fit in along this line of thought? Meat today definitely isn’t what it was in biblical times, today it has antibiotics and steroids, live stock are fed unnatural foods and grains. I don’t think the actual act of eating meet is sinful, I think it’s the results of eating these meats that defile ones body. anything unhealthy injested into our body that alters it from God’s initial plan of how he designed us, The body is the temple of the Lord…… How does fish fit in with the other meats? They don’t put steroids in fish, but some fish are farm raised now, sitting in chemically treated ponds of their own fecal matter, being fed unnatural man made foods again, Lake fish, ocean fed fish, even these types of fish come with warnings these days of excessive amounts of lead. I’m located near the Mississippi where the state authorities put out public messages not to eat more than one fish a week out the river because of the pollutants in the fish. I don’t think eating meat is a make or break ticket to heaven or hell, but again if the body is the temple of the Lord, these meats are altering our bodies in an unhealthy way that God did not intend. Thus for our own good/health should be avoided.

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    • Armchair Theologian says:

      I tested Ellen White along these lines.

      1) she claimed all her writings, letters books and all, were inspired. So I test them all by that standard. Thus, when she received the health message is irrelevant because to assert otherwise is to say God is lying.

      2) she taught that it is a sin to eat meat

      3) Jesus ate meat

      4) therefore Ellen White taught that Jesus was a sinner.

      I reject the various “abrogation” esque motifs SDA place on her. Such theories have more in common with Islam than they do Christianity. All of her words stand or fall on the claim that she attributed to herself.

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  5. GWASH says:

    Am an active adventist BUT I know Ellen G. White was wrong on health reform. The moment she connected meat eating with immoral behaviour she lost it. Meat eating is NOT a moral issue but a healthy one. If it’s a moral issue, it must have been so even in Jesus’ time. The sooner our adventist church comes out of denial that she was a spiritual gambler, the better for the church. FYI the bible and bible alone is able to show us the way to heaven.

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Evin Tucker says:

    I get that Ellen White was very much against eating meat, but where in these quotes does she say that it’s a sin? She certainly doesn’t say that explicitly.

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    • Armchair Theologian says:

      I come to this by connecting her teachings. Specifically she says eating meat creates bad blood, and that eating that which does not create good blood is a violation of the law of God.

      I think it’s a fair connection to make as I can draw the Nexus from one thesis to another.

      Liked by 1 person

  7. Melini Moodley says:

    The ridiculous part of Ellen’s teaching is that she fails to realise the implications of her message. The sin offering (meat) in the Old Covenant had to be eaten by the priests. So she is trying to say that God instituted the sinful (according to her) practice of eating meat to foreshadow the removal of sin?

    If she were living in the time of Israel how would she have celebrated the Passover without eating meat?

    It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to realise that this women is a false prophet with no credibility.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. Sheldon says:

    It is ironic that David Bhongs says (in a comment above) that no command is retroactive, in an attempt to show that when Christ ate meat it was not prohibited but that it is prohibited now since Ellen White’s has new light on the matter. To declare as an Adventist that no command is retroactive is to strike at one of the very cornerstones of the Adventist faith, which is the idea that the Sabbath commandment in Exodus 20 was not knew but a restatement of what patriarchs already knew. Adventists claim that because God rested on the seventh day at creation, that it doesn’t matter that no explicit command was given in all of the book of Genesis commanding anyone to keep the Sabbath holy. They point to the idea of their being unclean animals identified with Noah as proof that the Sabbath command dated back to the beginning of time. With this logic, you must assume that if eating meat is a sin since the late 1800’s (and fish are meat since they are simply animals who just happen to live in the sea, just as bird happen to occupy the skies) then it was a sin in Jesus’ day and Paul should not have warned us in 1 Timothy 4:3 that in last days that seducing spirits and demons would forbid people from eating meat.

    Liked by 1 person

  9. Melini says:

    Interesting how Ellen could never explain why God used the abominable practice of meat eat (abominable according to Ellen, that is) in the Sanctuary services to point to the covering and eventual removal of sin. The priests ate meat! If Ellen were alive then, her attempts to change the Sanctuary service and make the priests eat cabbage would have provided some comedic entertainment before all Israel congregated to stone her for being a false prophet.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. Larry Dean says:

    Adventists are quick to argue their favorite mistranslated proof-text: “Sin is the Transgression of the Law.” Adventists have painted themselves into a corner with this simplistic and ridiculous argument, as I will presently show. Even worse, Adventists agree with the Pharisaic enemies of Jesus that if Jesus broke the Sabbath, then he was a sinner and not God. (John 9:16). You see, that would be “violating God’s Law.”
    But God’s law REQUIRED eating the Lamb at Passover. It was mandatory. Under Adventism’s own ridiculous unbiblical and irrational sophistry, NOT-eating meat at Passover would have been a sin. Under Adventism’s own illogical sophistry, Jesus would have sinned by being a vegetarian. This commandment to eat the Passover lamb came straight from the Mouth of God and was “permanent and eternal” on the face of it. Moreover, the Passover was written in stone by the Finger of God, and is the First Commandment (Exodus 20:2):
    Exodus 12
    1 Now the Lord spoke to Moses……
    …..
    5 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year. You may take it from the sheep or from the goats. 6 Now you shall keep it until the fourteenth day of the same month. Then the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it at twilight. 7 And they shall take some of the blood and put it on the two doorposts and on the lintel of the houses where they eat it. 8 Then they shall eat the flesh on that night; roasted in fire, with unleavened bread and with bitter herbs they shall eat it. 9 Do not eat it raw, nor boiled at all with water, but roasted in fire—its head with its legs and its entrails. 10 You shall let none of it remain until morning, and what remains of it until morning you shall burn with fire. 11 And thus you shall eat it: with a belt on your waist, your sandals on your feet, and your staff in your hand. So you shall eat it in haste. It is the Lord’s Passover.
    ….
    14 ‘So this day shall be to you a memorial; and you shall keep it as a feast to the Lord throughout your generations. You shall keep it as a feast by an everlasting ordinance.”
    …..
    Therefore you shall observe this day throughout your generations as an everlasting ordinance.”
    ….
    24 And you shall observe this thing as an ordinance for you and your sons forever.”
    Adventist trolls sometimes disingenuously-argue that Jesus didn’t actually EAT the Lamb that he commanded Peter and John to sacrifice:
    “Then came the day of Unleavened Bread, on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed. So Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, “Go and prepare the Passover for us, that we may eat it.” Luke 22:7-8 ESV
    But that would have violated the unambiguous and unequivocal commandment in Exodus 12 to EAT the Passover Lamb. Under Adventism’s own ludicrous and unbiblical sophistry, it would have been a sin for Jesus to be a vegetarian.
    The utter nonsensical, irrational, and stridently-unbiblical lies of Adventism’s false prophet crashes and burns here. Bigly.

    Liked by 1 person

  11. songwriter52 says:

    These SDA comments are proof that the SDAs are hoodwinked by EGW. They got their little “pat” answers and cannot see beyond their own noses. Only those who truly desire to see truth will see it. When an SDA purposely takes his/her blinders off…then and only then can they see the error of the SDA’s false prophet. The writer makes it so plain, but those who will not see…won’t.

    Liked by 1 person

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